“Yeah, you have to understand that you’re chosen. There is always one person who is chosen to show the masses, right? We can’t listen to the masses. We have to influence the masses, okay? So you are chosen to show people that it can be done and show them that it’s possible. You’re the player. They’re the spectators. There’s a difference.”

ROB
Right.

RONNE
Okay? We can’t listen to the spectators because normally, the spectators have never played in the game.

ROB
Yeah. Truth… sprints--

RONNE
Yeah. The spectators and the commentators -- they’re sitting around critiquing everything that the people who are actually on the field are doing…

ROB
Yep.

RONNE
…but never played a day in their lives, any of them, right? So what I want to tell you all is that you’re going to have people that you are supposed to show them what’s possible.” -- Rob Richardson with Ronne Brown

---------------------

ROB RICHARDSON
Welcome to Disruption Now. I’m your host and moderator, Rob Richardson. On Disruption, we like to disrupt common narratives and constructs and certainly my guest today will do that.

Ronne Brown is… She’s many things. She’s a serial entrepreneur. She’s a leader. She’s an innovator. But if you look at her past and if you look at where she started, many people would be surprised. She wouldn’t be but many people would be surprised that she got here. But she doesn’t allow herself to be defined by others’ expectations or other circumstances. She sets her own path and I’m sure you’re going to see why.

She is the author of -- I want to say this right -- “From Mopping Floors to Making Millions on Instagram.” She is the founder of Girl CEO. She has, I believe, over 160,000 followers on Instagram. I could be off on that number. It’s really high. But she understood how to market early and she understood and realized her own value. And we’re going to talk to her more about her experience. It’s really a pleasure and honor to have her on. -- Ronne, how are you doing?

RONNE BROWN
I'm doing absolutely amazing. Thanks for having me.

ROB
Well I appreciate you coming on. I want to really talk to you about your book. I read your whole book, cover-to-cover. You have an amazing story. First of all, congratulations.

RONNE
Thank you.

ROB
I would love for people to understand your story. I'm sure your whole mission in life is to help more women and girls have your path and to understand their own power. So I just, again, want to thank you for that and I think that's necessary and it's why your story fits into our podcast.

Your background though, I want to initially talk about that time, kind of early in your life. You were that little girl... If you could take me back to when you were growing up and your parents were together and then they weren't and then your life really took a different turn. Talk about that for a minute from your book.

My real question isn't just that. I want you to take yourself back to that moment in that time when things changed so drastically in your life because I'm sure there's somebody, there's some woman that's going through that right now. What would you tell yourself now that you know everything you know now? Talk to that little girl and tell her… What do you want her to know?

RONNE
Well I think for me, I did not take it that hard, let me just say that…

ROB
Okay.

RONNE
…because I have relationships with my parents. And I was not like a normal kid.

ROB
Right.

RONNE
So while other children would be like devastated… I was always a little ahead of my time. I knew that my mom was in a toxic situation. My father wasn't a bad father. He's a great father. But I was mature enough to understand that sometimes things don't work out in life, right?

ROB
Sure.

RONNE
And because of that split… Of course, I was hurt a little but I wasn't that person that resented my parents for doing what was best for them.

ROB
Right.

RONNE
Right? I was really proud of my mom. I encouraged my mom and it worked out the way it was supposed to work out. So in that season in my life, my parents splitting, it really didn’t affect me that much. My mom was still involved in my life. My dad was still there. I think the biggest thing was my environment.

ROB
Well that’s where I want to get to. So let me state the question a little more specifically. You talked about the environment changing because of who your father was dating and the people that will come around. It was a very different environment.

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
Environments affects how you think and sometimes what you think is possible. I want you just to think about that environment because there's somebody going through that environment right now. You know that.

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
You know that there's a lot of people going through the same type of challenges you had at that time. What would you tell yourself as you were going through… I want to talk about the moments of struggle that you had. That's what I want to talk about.

RONNE
Yeah. So for me I think that I would tell myself to work harder, to get around a different type of crowd. Growing up, I was living in the projects. I was living in a crack house. I was surrounded by guys who were like selling drugs in the neighborhood. I was really being exposed to a life that someone in my age probably should not have been exposed to. But what I will say is that that environment, believe It or not, it taught me survival.

ROB
Sure.

RONNE
Right? It taught me survival and it gave me a broader outlook on life. One of the things I understand, and I know now from being in that situation, is that it's really about exposure in life. Your destiny can change based on exposure. But it can also stay the same based on lack of exposure.

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
So in that season, when I was in that environment and I was around those kind of people, you don't know what you don't know until you know.

ROB
Yep.

RONNE
And you have to be eager… If you're in an environment right now where everybody around you is comfortable and everybody around you is going in a different direction and you really want more out of life, you have to be dedicated to getting around different people to change the trajectory of your life. That's the only thing that helped me.

If I would have stayed in that environment, around a lot of poverty-minded people who were comfortable, who were content, who were doing the wrong thing to get ahead then I would have fell right into that trap. Many of the people that I grew up with, they did.

ROB
Yeah. You know, it's very difficult to avoid toxic people once you get used to… I tell people, you can get used to anything over time and if your mind is conditioned that way… You don't even know what you don't know.

So you were at a point where you were around people, some of which you couldn't help. But how did you take those intentional steps to get outside of that to meet the right people? How did you do that? Because you said in your book, the reason why you do what you do now… You looked to Oprah. You got some other people that you look to…

RONNE
Yeah, you’re right. It’s not--

ROB
…but essentially, there's not a lot of people that have your story and talked about, “Okay, look, I didn't live…” And no, there is no perfect life, by the way. “I didn't live the so-called “Idealistic way” -- Do this. Do that. Make sure that you go to college. Do this.” You didn't go down a “traditional path.” Talk to people about that. How did you get out of that, not really having a lot of people around you in your corner? How did you know to go out and seek people and where to find them?

RONNE
So the first thing I started to do was I created a side hustle.

ROB
Okay.

RONNE
That was me making products in my home. And then when I was making those products, I was working as a janitor. I did that. That was the first thing. As I started to do that, I realized that the people that I was hanging around every single day, they weren’t buying anything from me.

ROB
When was that? When did you do that? How old were you started this side hustle?

RONNE
Oh that was probably like 2008-2009.

ROB
Okay.

RONNE
So that was a few years ago. That was a while ago. But I realized that the people that I was around, they weren't going to buy anything. They were willing to do testing for me and get free samples but very few--

ROB
They weren't willing to support.

RONNE
No.
ROB
When you talk about that…And we said this. A lot of “No…” But I think it's a very, very important point to hit on. The people you surround yourself with have more to do with your success than almost anything else. I fundamentally believe that. And actually, science have shown the people around you literally rewire your brain. You begin to think or act and be like the people around you…

RONNE
For sure.

ROB
…and so you got to leave that environment. What you told me is you actually had to leave. But how hard is that to leave people that you think are your sis--

RONNE
Well let me just say that--

ROB
Go ahead.

RONNE
Let me back it up a little bit because I'm not telling people to leave their environment. What I'm telling you all to do is leverage the Internet. That's what I did.

ROB
Okay.

RONNE
I couldn't get out of the environment because I was broke.

ROB
Yes.

RONNE
Okay? But what I could do is I could connect with people who weren’t online.

ROB
Yes.

RONNE
And that's where making that connection and using the Internet comes into play because I lived in the projects. There wasn't no just up and leaving the projects, okay? We don't help people by just running away. That's the first.

ROB
I agree.

RONNE
The second thing is I lived there for a very long time. Even my first home, I bought it in the inner city of DC. I was making millions of dollars a year and I stayed there because you know what, I was dedicated to bringing those people on along with me and teaching themselves sales and teaching them marketing and teaching them how to use the Internet.

ROB
That’s dope.

RONNE
So as far as getting out, I didn't get out. I stayed. I mentally evolved, okay? And then I connected with people online who had the knowledge and who had the wisdom. And I started using Facebook first. And Facebook, people used to have events and things of that nature. I would show up to those Facebook events and it will put me in places around people that were having different types of conversations.

And in that time, I really didn't know what the hell people were talking about and I will just pretend and just shake my head… because I didn't go to college. I didn't know about investing. I didn’t know about any of those things. I just knew how to sell something. I just knew how to post it online. I just knew how to make it look good. I used to literally get feedback from people on what they wanted. That is how I started my business.

ROB
Right. That's awesome. Just for point of clarification, when I say “leave,” I wasn't saying leave necessarily the projects or leave an area that might not have as many opportunities. I was saying leave the friends and leave the people that aren’t trying to push you in the right direction.

RONNE
Okay. Sure.

ROB
So that's really what I was trying to get to and wanted you to…

RONNE
Okay. Sure.

ROB
…talk about relationships. Let's actually move to that a little bit and then I want to talk about your entrepreneurial journey because--

RONNE
I mean I--

ROB
Go ahead.

RONNE
I was going to say, I think that as you grow and you start to evolve -- and I'm sure you know this, Rob -- you won't even have to leave the people. They will begin to fall off as your evolution happens because watching you evolve or the conversations that you have, they will start to be boring to those kind of people, right?

ROB
Right, yep.

RONNE
The conversations won't even interest them. As I begin to grow and I started talking about different things like building a legacy and getting out of debt and paying off a home or getting an investment property or making sure my credit was good or trying to create a business, people would just… they would get tired of being around me.

ROB
Yeah. I can see that because then you don't share anything in common with them. What are you going to talk about? You’re not talking about going to the club. You're talking about, “Well let's actually try to build a business to figure out a way--”

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
“If we're going to the club, how are we going to make money? Are we promoting the event? Otherwise, why are we going?”

RONNE
Exactly.

ROB
And you’re right. You're so right about that. And I say this, and to emphasize this point, we had Eric Thomas on the show, one of the number one motivational speakers in the country. He said this point that I think is important to people to understand because… “No matter what environment you're in, you can be in the most challenging environment--”
Look, there are other Ronnie Browns in the hood. There are Rob Richardsons in the hood. There are people that are aspiring, that are… Hang around those people. Talk to those people because relationships are not neutral. They do one of two things. They lift you up or they pull you down. There's really no in-between I've seen.

RONNE
For sure.

ROB
So--

RONNE
For sure.

ROB
Go ahead.

RONNE
And a lot of times, you get this pushback from your peers -- that you're changing or you think you’re better. And that’s a trick. People do that to you to make you question yourself and your choices. And a lot of times, they go in that direction because your growth, it makes them uncomfortable.

ROB
Yep.

RONNE
And I think this is the biggest thing that I tell people even right now when starting businesses and bringing employees on board with their companies is be careful bringing people on board with you that knew you back before you became who you are now because there's a lack of respect almost. They can't really receive from you. They can't really respect it. They can't really see the vision because they're constantly seeing you in the light of who you used to be.

ROB
Yeah. Hey, that's real deep. That's real deep. That has to be a hard part though. When you reach that kind of breaking point and when you've been in relationships with people and they're used to a dynamic where they're able to control you or they're negative and they can affect how you feel, once that's no longer true, there's usually anger. If you can just talk about a time when you had to move out of a toxic situation, when you may not have realized it was toxic but then you realized, “Okay, I have to make this change for my life” because I think that's one of the things that really holds a lot of people back.

A lot of people have the ability… the mental ability, just the acumen to do things but what holds them back is their emotion or lack of being able to get out of these situations or people that want to bring them down. And I'm sure you've had challenges like that. If you want to just talk about one that might stick out in your head so people can know, “Okay, Ronne has gone from making millions but Ronne had struggles just like me in relationships or with her family or with her friends.”

RONNE
Yeah. I think that the biggest thing that I had to really just overcome was being an enabler.

ROB
Hmm. How so?

RONNE
Sometimes, when you come from a certain environment and you understand money… There is one person in every family that people call when they're late on their rent, when they can't pay their car loan, when they’ve screwed their money up. Initially, you're like the superhero and you want to save everybody. You may give out loan after loan after loan after loan. And it even goes into friendships, right, because then your friends, they start asking. And then they want you to do this and they want you to do that and then they want you to do free advertising and they want you to do… And you get to a place where you're getting called in a million different directions.

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
You only have the strength to stand up for yourself and say “No.” Like in the last two years, I've really had to learn the power of just saying “No.”

ROB
There's a lot of power in “No.” There really is. -- There really is. -- I mean I've had to learn that, too. Because look, if you're saying “Yes” to something then… All the things you're saying “Yes” to, you're taking away from yourself, too. That means if you don't prioritize yourself, somebody else will, right?

RONNE
For sure. And people are going to get pissed off.

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
You’re going to a lot of people during that time frame but you have to… I think this is a part of self-care.

ROB
I agree. And I think it's also a part of… Back to understanding relationships, there's just basically two types of relationships, overall. We talked about pulling up or pulling down but I think there's another way of looking at it, too. You either have a completely transactional relationship or you have a relationship that's based upon having a relationship. It is not centered on just the result. It's centered on return for both parties no matter what that is.

Look, I've really learned that through my experience as well. This brother I had on the show, he talked about his faith and how he became stronger in his faith when he actually lost his daughter. That's interesting to me because I'm not sure if I could say that losing my child would make my faith stronger. So I asked him to explain that. He said, “Look, you have to understand, Rob, that when you pray to God and you pray in your relationship… Your prayer and faith can't be tied to the outcome because then it's just transactional.”

So it's the same way, actually, in how we actually relate to God. I never thought about it that way because prayer is not tied to the outcome and your faith in God can't be tied to the outcome. I think when people think about it, it's like, “Okay, well, if I have faith and I believe it doesn't go the way I expected then do you still have faith?” If you don't, that's not real faith. Your relationships can't always be dependent upon what you want out of it. They have to be to put it on… If you like the person, if you believe in the person, then you do it and don't always expect an exact return for what you do. You just do it because you believe in him.

RONNE
Exactly.

ROB
Yeah. So you said a point about “Shame is not shameful. Being ashamed is shameful.”

RONNE
For sure.

ROB
What did you mean by that?

RONNE
Being in the shame of what you've been through, you know. I think that there is a level of insecurity that so many people carry and they're ashamed of their story. They're ashamed of their past. They’re ashamed of the days that they've been through, the people that have hurt them, the things that didn't work out, the relationships that fell. They're so ashamed of those things. And I think that the only thing you should be ashamed of is being ashamed of those things, right…

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
…because those stories and those trials and those things that you’ve gone through in your life, that’s your testimony.

ROB
Amen, yep.

RONNE
But it’s also the key to free some other people, right? There are so many people… I put up a post about this on my social media. I think it was yesterday. I said, “Some of you are sitting on some stories that are really going to help some people get freed from the battles that they're going through in their heads. But because you won't tell the story on how you overcame it, people are out here feeling defeated because you won't tell your real story.”

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
People would tell the story but they won't tell the real story.

ROB
They'll tell the kind of story that looks like, “Oh I made it here. All of a sudden, I had this good idea and it’s--“

RONNE
The rags to riches story.

ROB
Exactly.

RONNE
It’s like they’ll tell the rags to riches story. But let's talk about the depression story. Let's talk about the hurt story. Let's talk about the molestation. I’ve talked to so many women and they talk about the success. But there's a deeper story. You were molested but you don't want to tell that story. Someone needs to hear that. They’re struggling on the inside, you know.
ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
I just feel like we have to get to a space but we understand that we have a responsibility.

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
And that responsibility is to free someone else through our truth -- the real story. I tell people I grew up in a crack house. They're like [imitates a stunned expression]. I was, “Yeah. [I grew up in the hood. You think it’s not bad - 21:32]. [Laughter] Like, I had to know how to fight when I grew up. Like, 315, you [have to fight - 21:41]. [Laughter] I grew up in that kind of neighborhood. People ask me, “How do you get so confident? Like you don't care what people say.” “Sure, my baby. Where I grew up there, you had to know how to Joans to survive.”

ROB
Yeah. Yeah, you do.

RONNE
You have to have your armor on. So what people say about me now, if you heard the things that the kids said to me back then… I grew up Joaning. You had to practice your Joans before you went to school when you grew up in the hood. So now, that kind of stuff, it doesn’t even bother you.

ROB
That’s so true. Understanding that your experiences, your struggles, your failures, all of that shape who you are. And if you're comfortable telling it, people will believe you more. And you talked about that in your book.

In your book, you made a point that you really started seeing the impact… because you used to hide from the fact that you were a single mother at some point. And then you just said, “No, this is who I am. Why should I be ashamed of it” and people really started to resonate with you more when that happened. People are afraid to be themselves though. But I think you're also comfortable with yourself.

RONNE
Yeah. One of the things that I really just stress is that when you're a mother in corporate America, it is not easy, you know. People say, “Well why would you have to hide the fact that you have kids?”

ROB
Please.

RONNE
Because they won't hire your tail if they feel like you have children because the first thing that they think is you're going to always need off for doctor's appointment, you're going to be late, your children are going to get sick, you're going to have issues. So they look at you like, “Oh my goodness, this is a liability.”

ROB
Yep, there's no doubt about that. In your book, you talk about that experience. You also talk about this one… There’s one moment I really want to talk about, is when you really wanted this job and you thought they were going to fire you and you got on your knees and asked them to not fire you and they didn't fire you then but they fired you later on in that day which is totally crazy.

RONNE
Let me work the whole day, Rob.

ROB
That's crazy.

RONNE
Let me work the whole… That’s how they get the last bit out of you just like that.

ROB
That’s crazy. I mean they just want to take your dignity that way. That's just crazy. Talk about that moment because that has to be like… Whoa, that's one of those gut-punching… somebody just hit you in a gut. Like you want to go back to when you were in high school. You got hit in the gut and the face in that moment.

RONNE
If I could be super transparent right now…

ROB
Yeah, please.

RONNE
…that was one of the moments in my life that I made the decision that I was going to go in a different direction. It was in that moment. It was the most embarrassing, the most humiliating and… It made me say to myself, “Black woman, do something for you so that you don't ever have to beg anyone to give you an opportunity to provide and feed your children ever again.”

I was working at a call center for Kaiser Permanente and I was literally 19 or 20 years old. I would never forget this. I was pregnant with my daughter. I was about seven or eight months pregnant and I showed up for work and I think I was two minutes late. And I went in, I was sick as a dog. I was going through pregnancy.

ROB
Right. Sure.

RONNE
I drove. It took me about an hour to get to work in traffic everyday -- literally, over an hour. I was broke. You know, I was broke. I had tickets on my car. I was hiding my car from the tow man. I got to work and they were going to let me go. Christmas was around the corner. I would never forget it. I was driving a burgundy Acura and it was tore up. When I tell you, that car… You ever drive a car and you pray to your destination?

ROB
Yes, yes, yes. [Laughter] I’ve had a car like that.

RONNE
That was my little car where I prayed--

ROB
That was automobile in ’98. Go ahead.

RONNE
Exactly. I prayed to that job every day on my way there. “God, just get me here. Get me home. Get me here. Get me home.” And I got there and they told me… She’s like, “It’s policy. You're fired.” And I remember getting on my knees. My supervisor was this tall Caucasian woman. I got down on my knees and I begged her. I was pregnant. I mean pregnant-pregnant. And I said, “I need this job. Please, I really need it” and I begged. She said, “Okay, okay, okay. I’ll give you another chance.” And at the end of the day, she called me in and she told me that they had decided to let me go.

ROB
That's just nuts.

RONNE
And I drove home and I was bawling. I tell people all the time, that ride home, when you turn the music down and there's no music playing, that's when you're really thinking. And in that moment in my life, I told myself, I said, “I am going to create my own income in some way so that no one can ever have that type of control over me.”

ROB
That's awesome and you're doing it. So the next days after that, you went and you were seeking capital. I remember the response that you got from the bank… [Laughter] I want to talk about getting past “No” because I think people need to hear. As an entrepreneur, when I--

Before I did this, I ran for office. I ran for treasurer the state of Ohio. And what that taught me… It taught me a lot. I had to figure out a way to raise millions of dollars. And I got to $2.5 million. But between that $2.5 million and zero was about 80% of a bunch of “Nos,” right?

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
Tell folks your experience with “No” and how you just have to move past it.

RONNE
Well I believe that you should go for the “No.”

ROB
Okay.

RONNE
That’s the biggest thing that I teach right now is just going for the “No.” The more you hear the word “No,” the less it affects you.

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
Right? You literally adapt to it. It’s like, “Oh, no? Okay, great. So do you have someone who you think would…” You know, you go around it.

ROB
Exactly.

RONNE
You ask for referrals. You come back… “No” doesn't mean “No” forever.

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
I learned that “No” means “Not right now.”

ROB
Yep.

RONNE
And studies show that people normally say “No” seven times before they say “Yes.”

ROB
Sounds right.

RONNE
So keep that in mind.

ROB
Seven times before they say “Yes.”

RONNE
Yeah, seven times. Seven times before they say “Yes.”

ROB
Wow. So when you first started your leap of faith to being an entrepreneur… because it is leap of faith. You say you have to come from somewhere out of nowhere. Your friends and family, particularly your mother, you really discussed the challenge of making her understand something that she had never been a part of.

RONNE
Never.

ROB
That story is repeated particularly with African-Americans a lot.

RONNE
For sure.

ROB
We don't have the… There are some people that do, obviously. But collectively, overall, there's not in as many pathways examples of what entrepreneurship is. We're told, “Look, you’ll make it if you go to college and do what you're supposed to do,” which is not really the truth, by the way, which I also want to touch on. How did you get your mother and others who obviously love you… You can't say they don't love you but they don't understand what you're trying to do.

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
When you have that and they're telling you, “You're crazy. You got babies to feed. What do you mean you're going to go be an entrepreneur? You don't have time…” How do you navigate that when your family and friends are telling you, “Baby girl, you’re crazy. What do you think? Well how are you going to make millions? What are you talking about?” Somebody else is going through that now.

RONNE
Yeah. You have to understand that you're chosen. There is always one person who is chosen to show the masses, right? We can't listen to the masses. We have to influence the masses. Okay? You are chosen to show people that it can be done and show them that it's possible, right? You're the player. Okay? They're the spectators. There's a difference.

ROB
Right.

RONNE
Okay? We can't listen to the spectators because normally, the spectators have never played in the game.

ROB
Yep, truth… sprints--

RONNE
Yeah, the spectators and the commentators. Do you ever see that? They're sitting around critiquing everything that the people who are actually on the field are doing but they never played a day in their lives -- any of them, right?

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
So what I want to tell you all is that you're going to have people that you are supposed to show them what's possible. You're supposed to show them. You're not supposed to listen to them. You're supposed to inspire them, right?

Our parents come from a place where they were taught to always be the worker…

ROB
Correct.
RONNE
…or a different race, right? If we work for this race then we are successful and we consider that security. Why do we find security in working for companies that are owned by people who don't look like us but we don't feel like we can find that same security and stability in owning something of our own?

ROB
Yeah. You said it well. You said it well. You said it well, and really looking at not being defined by stupid standards. Look, I went to college. I have several degrees but I don't think… A matter of fact, I know that does not lead to security. That does not lead to more opportunities [crosstalk]--

RONNE
A lease to debt.

ROB
Go ahead.

RONNE
A lease to a lot of debt.

ROB
A lease to a lot of debt most of time, particularly, if you have no plan for what you're doing. College can be… If you go to the right college, you have the right opportunities. It's good for one thing. It's good for the relationships. In relationships, in order to leverage… That's really it. That, to me, is it. That's it. And I think people if you get lost in anything else, college is not going to save you.

Look, people are looking for people with skills that can help them add value nowadays. And just because you have a degree, nobody's going to say… But initially, you did have some struggles with that in not being defined by those dumb standards.

RONNE
Oh for sure.

ROB
Talk to people about not being defined… What one of my sayings… one of my billboard sayings is -- It's my mother’s. It's not my saying -- “Define yourself for yourself by yourself.”

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
So I don't define myself by other people's standards. But how did you get that when everybody said you're supposed to go to college? “You don't know what you're doing. You're supposed to be in college. Why should I listen to you?” When that banker told you, when you asked for that loan, if I remember right, “What are talking about? Did you go to college? Why would I give you a loan?”

RONNE
Exactly. I think that I made a decision to live life on my terms. -- I made a decision to live life on my terms. -- I made what I wanted to do the norm. And I think that people have to make a decision that I am going to draft out what my life was going to look like. And for all the people who don't think it's cool and acceptable, I'm going to make it the norm for them.

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
Right? They're going to realize that I own my vision and I'm going to live my life on my terms. I mean right now, heck, I'm literally sitting up in the bed. I'm doing this podcast. This is my life.

ROB
That’s a good life.

RONNE
I’m going to design it the way that I want to design it and it won't change the wisdom. I won't change the knowledge. I'm traveling all week long. You have to design your life. Look at people like Gary Vee. Who would have thought that someone can just put on a t-shirt, some jeans, some tennis shoes and stay in front of people of corporate America cursing at the top of their lungs and get paid hundreds and thousands of dollars to come and speak and do that?

ROB
Exactly.

RONNE
I’ve been cursing my whole life. You know what I’m saying? [Laughter] But he had to redefine… You have to redefine things and say, “This is my cool.”

ROB
Yeah. That is really good. It's really good. So the mindset of an entrepreneur which is… You got to change your mindset from being a worker. What would be your first piece of advice to someone that wants to be an entrepreneur, just doesn't know how to take the first leap or the first step? What would you tell them to do?

RONNE
Well the first thing you have to do is understand that you can get over in corporate America but you can't get over with yourself in your own business, right…

ROB
Mm.

RONNE
…because many of us have mastered looking busy. We know how to pop screen up when the ball comes around the corner.

ROB
Right.

RONNE
You know, you know how to look busy. So the first thing that they’re going to have to do is change the mindset because if you cheat yourself, you cheat your bank account. The only person you cheat in entrepreneurship is your checking account.

ROB
Hmm.

RONNE
There's no getting over.

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
So make sure that you have the level of dedication that is required to survive in this lifestyle because every day that you wake up, you have one goal… Well two goals. It is “more exposure” and to “run transactions.”

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
It’s just that simple. So you can look busy, you can take pictures in front of the laptop, you can bullshit your day away[laughter] and [indiscernible - 35:47] ] but if you become an entrepreneur, your bank account will only reflect one thing and it's going to be your work ethic. It’s just that simple.

ROB
Yep. That’s true because you can't depend on somebody else bringing you that check. You got to go find it. You keep what you kill in this business.

RONNE
You're not going to be looking at the clock because there will not be an hourly pay connected to it. You can sit there and just watch it go down. If it goes down, if you're not being productive then your bank account is going to go down with it. So the first thing is make sure you're really ready for this rodeo because it’s going to be one hell of a ride.

ROB
As a lesson, we talked about getting past “Nos” as an entrepreneur, and you've obviously talked about the mindset of an entrepreneur. Let's talk a little more about failures. And I want to think about a failure or a struggle. What's the one failure or struggle that sticks out in your mind at any point in your entrepreneurial experience and how did you learn and grow from that experience?

RONNE
I think my coachability.

ROB
Okay.

RONNE
Sometimes, when you make a certain amount of money, it decreases your coachability index because you think that because you've made a certain amount of money, you know something. But there are a lot of dumb people that make a lot of money.

ROB
Tons of them.

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
Tons of them that become president, too. But never mind. I'm not going there. Go ahead.

RONNE
[Laughter] Exactly.

ROB
I’ll keep… Go ahead.

RONNE
There are a lot of dumb people that make a lot of money. So what I realized, even about myself early on in my successes, that I will always talk about what I've done and what I've accomplished and I thought that that qualified me.

ROB
Sure.

RONNE
Right? And in all actuality, it held me back. So to everyone who's listening to this podcast, stop telling people what you've done and how you got there. They’re trying to teach you a different way, a different route. There's a different journey. There is more than one way to skin a cat. So what if that's how you got there before?

That held me back because as I evolved, I realized I had to learn to invest in new knowledge, in new coaches. And when people were attempting to coach me, I will always think that I had it together based on the amount of money that I made and I’ll hold myself back.

ROB
Makes sense. Can you think of something in particular that really sticks out? You talked about coachability. But can you think of a moment where it was like, “Oh had I seen that differently, I could have gotten more”?

RONNE
Sure. There was a moment where I needed to get some training for my business. I needed to get some systems in place so I can be more productive; so I can really scale my business. The investment I was required from the coach was about $15,000.

ROB
Mm-hmm.

RONNE
Okay?

ROB
That’s about right for a coach for a minimum.

RONNE
Yeah. And it was for four days for 15 grand.

ROB
Oh. That’s a good coach.

RONNE
Yeah. But you know what? Some people will say, “What? That’s crazy.” But you, Rob, you said, “What? That’s a good coach.” Yeah. But my mindset was, “I'm not paying this money.” I don't want to pay this because I feel like I'm way ahead and I shouldn't have to pay this… This is a ridiculous amount of money. So I went somewhere else and I tried to get the same coaching and it was for $5000. And guess what he gave me for $5000.

ROB
What did he give you?

RONNE
Nothing.

ROB
[Laughter] You said “$5000.”

RONNE
Nothing. Right?

ROB
Wow. And then they came with the second payment and it was $10,000. So I was $10,000 in the hole. I was like, “What is going on?” Everything that they told me, I already knew. And nothing changed from my business. I pulled out that American Express card. I went to the guy that was going to charge me the 15 and I got that mentoring. Within 30 days, I generated $50,000 in income.

ROB
Wow. Wow. Well it sounds like a good coach. I might hire that coach, too. [Laughter]

So let’s kind of move to your legacy and about what you want out all of this. What's one important truth you have… So I’d like to say everybody that is an innovator or entrepreneur that goes against the grain, they do things that they believe that a lot of other people think are crazy, that the majority don't agree with. What's your important truth that very few people agree with you on?

RONNE
That if you can build someone else's system, you can build your own.

ROB
Hmm, okay. That's your truth.

RONNE
I'm at a space in my life where I am so sick of the word “Security” when it comes from people who don't realize that they're literally building someone else's stuff.

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
You're building someone else's estate. You're building someone else's retirement, their family ranch, their islands and all of the other things. And the level of that occasion that you had to that should make you feel convicted in your spirit that you're not doing it for your family and yourself.

ROB
Yeah. You're right about that. It's so amazing when you think about Tyler Perry… You made me think about Tyler Perry and what he just did.

RONNE
I’ve been watching it [inaudible - 41:33].

ROB
Ain’t that amazing? You think about like somebody… He was ignored, right?

RONNE
Legacy.

ROB
Legacy. He was ignored. I think people need to hear this. You were ignored, too. People told you there's no way you're going to go and be successful, have a huge business. You were a single mother. You have children out of wedlock. You were not going to be successful according to the masses. If you look at Tyler Perry story, he shouldn't have been successful. And he's been ignored by Hollywood. And this man has a studio that's larger than all Hollywood. That kind of really goes to your point.

And I also think, by the way, Black people in particular have so much talent that we do not value or understand. Black people start trends. Everybody's buying Popeye's chicken in the millions because Black people said they want some Popeye’s chickens. I mean that's one example of many that we can do to build our own legacy.

RONNE
Can I just tell you, Rob, it's disappointing to watch and really to know that it's still happening right now, that we still don't know our value. We still don't understand the contribution that we make in the world and we still feel more confident in other people's systems, services and products than our own. I mean I've had friends that I've offered, “Do this with me” and they're like, “No. I rather just go do this for this person” that looks nothing like us because it's easier, right?
ROB
It’s been conditioned. Look, it's learned helplessness. That's what it is. It's learned helplessness that we have adopted. If you look at what happened post-integration, when we got opportunities, there were whole communities that used to be black and brown and thriving and people literally moved out of and now white people are investing in them and now they're moving out and now Black people can't get back into the neighborhoods that used to be theirs. They didn't realize their own value when they were in it. So everybody's moving back to the hood. I don't know where you lived in DC. My guess is it's probably a lot more valuable now--

RONNE
[Inaudible - 43:38].

ROB
…than it was then.

RONNE
It’s happening [indiscernible - 43:43]. It’s happening everywhere.

ROB
Everywhere, right? But that part of that is like… This is not an indictment on capitalism. This is an indictment on how we think of how capitalism is as a community. We got to understand this.

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
Absolutely.

RONNE
It's also about lack of knowledge.

ROB
It's a lot about lack of knowledge.

RONNE
You know, I was [inaudible - 44:00] public schools and the school systems are teaching everything except for investing, credit, how to start a business, marketing. You're not learning that. You're learning why Y minus two equals Z and depending on what field you go in, let me know how often you use that. The things that you need to know -- investing, real estate, equity, building equity, having good credit -- these are the things that… No one's teaching you that so you don't understand. You don't understand. You just get that credit card from Capital One when you're 18 and you go blow it out the water. And then the next thing you know, your credit is ruined forever.

ROB
And that's on purpose. I think it's intentional. I tell people, “Superman is not coming. Iron Man is not coming. Hulk is not coming. Nobody is coming to save. We got to save ourselves.” This is how it looks.

RONNE
Exactly.

ROB
So I appreciate what you do because people need to know that it's possible. If you got a billboard -- let's call it a “Google Ad” or… Wait. Wait. You're the Instagram Queen -- Instagram ad that has your billboard or has your saying in life, what does that say and why?

RONNE
If it had my say in life?

ROB
Yeah, you're saying in life. -- you're saying, your theme, however you want to say it. What does that say and why?

RONNE
It will probably say, “No excuses. Only solutions.”

ROB
Okay. I think that's pretty obvious given your background why you say that because you can show the results of that.

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
My final question: You have a committee of three, living or dead, that advises you on life and on business. Who are those three people and why?

RONNE
It will probably be Napoleon Hill. [Laughter]

ROB
Okay. Okay.

RONNE
It would probably also be Oprah Winfrey.

ROB
Okay.

RONNE
My last person will probably be Bill Gates -- I’m sure.

ROB
Tell me why for each one.

RONNE
Napoleon Hill just thought outside of the box. His thoughts and his practices about getting the right people; you not having to have it but getting around the people who have what you need to build things. I think he had the mindset of a planter. He just knew how to just build and just get the fruit and get the best out of the people around him. That was the first thing.

He just talks about, all the time, just having the right people around you. And if you have one person around you that doubts the mission, you have to get rid of them. And just hearing him speak on that and just think about my progress and building a company and a movement and growing Girl CEO, it's been one of those things that just continues to just resonate with me.

ROB
Girl CEO, by the way, we didn't talk a lot about that -- your company. I want to hit on that as we get towards the end but finish the other two.

RONNE
And Oprah Winfrey, just overcoming all of the things that she's overcoming; just continuing to flourish and just be as impactful as she is and just monetize her influence on the level that she's monetized at the media and using her voice and being fearless. I think one of the things that I admire and I would love to sit down and ask her is, “How are you so truthful and transparent with race while still getting the support from other races?”

ROB
Yeah.

RONNE
It’s just like, “Wow” because we're taught to not really express our thoughts on like racism and she does it in such confidence. But still women of other races still embrace her in that truth. It's just something I’ve never seen before.
ROB
She’s pretty special. And Bill Gates?

RONNE
Of course.

ROB
Yeah. I mean he’s got the knowledge.

RONNE
Yeah, the knowledge, the mindset, the experience. You know, people who go through those journeys in life where they are the only person who believes in something and every one doubts them and they're crazy enough to carry it out, those are some really powerful people.

ROB
Yeah. That's been you. I can see why. Those folks actually align with who you are so that makes sense. I mean they share a lot of your path and your struggles.

RONNE
Yeah.

ROB
Look, I think you measure a part of success. You've been very successful. And I can argue, you've been as successful as those people because I think success is measured not by how far you've come but the obstacles and the struggles you had to overcome to get there.

RONNE
I think if I could sit down with Bill Gates, I would just say, “What did you tell yourself to stay as confident as you remain through all the doubt, all the failure? What was it that you were saying to yourself?’

ROB
Yeah. So what do you say to yourself because you have to do the same thing?

RONNE
Every day, I just say, “It's going to happen. It's coming. Someone needs to see you. Keep going. Someone needs to see you so they can know it is possible for them. You're going to create a legacy. You're going to show other Black women that it's possible. This is one of great… some generational curses. You're chosen. You're on a mission. You're anointed.” These are the things that I say to myself every day.

ROB
It sounds like your mission could be to break generational curses, too. It sounds like that's part of what you're trying to do. So Girl CEO is going to do that and I have no doubt about that. They can find more about you… It's girlceo.com.

RONNE
It’s girlceoinc.com.

ROB
Okay, girlceoinc.com -- Ronne Brown, Instagram. She’s on LinkedIn. -- You have a YouTube station too as well?

RONNE
Yes, I am. I’m everywhere.

ROB
She’s everywhere. You could find her everywhere. I just want to tell you that I am proud of what you've done, proud of what you're going to do and look forward to seeing you on the show again and really working together in the future.

RONNE
Thank you so much, Rob. And to everyone that's listening to this, if you're looking for some ways to just really grow your business and your brand, you all can grab my free guide at girlceoguide.com.

ROB
And we’ll have a link to her book. We'll have a link to all of her channels, on her YouTube as well as Instagram, everywhere else where you want to find her. -- Anyway, look forward to seeing you soon. Please keep us abreast of any event you have. I think you said you were having a conference. We’ll definitely love to promote that.

RONNE
[We’re year, we’re on it - 51:09]. Okay. Thank you so much, Rob.

ROB
Thank you, Ronne.

[END OF TRANSCRIPT]